News

Microsoft Rewrites Exam Policy

Microsoft's certification and skills assessment group rewrites exam policy, allowing MCSE on Windows 2000 candidates to count formerly retired exams as valid electives.

You may recall that just recently, Microsoft's certification and skills assessment group has rewritten its exam and certification policy (see "Microsoft Rescinds Retirement of NT 4.0 MCSE Track" in News). An interesting change to note is how Microsoft is now allowing MCSE on Windows 2000 candidates to count formerly retired exams as valid electives.

According to an announcement posted on the company's MCP Web site, "Discontinuation of Exams," Microsoft has added formerly retired exams to the MCSE on Windows 2000 track. It also now considers these exams as "discontinued" — to distinguish them as still having validity — rather than retired. (This change hasn't been made site-wide; as of this writing, some pages on the Microsoft site still use the word "retired" for the same, discontinued exams.)

The announcement also says that current and future exams will have a minimum shelf life of two years, after which exams will be discontinued as needed. The discontinuation indicates that some exams, while no longer available, can still be counted toward newer certifications and tracks.

Discontinued exams that now count under the Windows 2000 track include:

  • 70-013, Implementing and Supporting SNA Server 3.0
  • 70-018, Implementing and Supporting Systems Management Server 1.2
  • 70-026, System Administration for SQL Server 6.5
  • 70-027, Implementing a Database Design on SQL Server 6.5
  • 70-059, Internetworking with TCP/IP on Windows NT 4.0
  • 70-076, Implementing and Supporting Exchange Server 5
  • 70-087, Implementing and Supporting Internet Information Server 4.0
  • 70-078, Implementing and Supporting Proxy Server 1.0
  • 70-079, Implementing and Supporting Internet Explorer 4.0 by Using the Internet Explorer Administration Kit

Microsoft hasn't indicated whether exams such as 70-067, Windows NT 4.0 Server, will be brought out of retirement. To see the matrix for the MCSE on Windows 2000, click here.

The new policy ties in with the company's recent decision not to retire certifications themselves — instead, titles will be identified by track (MCSE NT 4.0, MCSE 2000, etc.).
— CertCities.com Editor Becky Nagel contributed to this report.

About the Author

Michael Domingo is Editor in Chief of Virtualization Review. He's been an IT writer and editor for so long that he remember typing out news items in WordStar.

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Reader Comments:

Tue, Nov 27, 2001 Brandon South Africa

It doesn't make sense. I paid for Tuition for both IIS4 & TCP/IP and didn't write the exams because of the retirement policy.Paid again for Proxy 2 & SQL 2000 tuition.

Wed, Nov 21, 2001 Scott Kent, UK

This would have been a good idea if it had been stated this was the case from the beginning. As it was we have had e-mails from MS every month pushing us to upgrade before Christmas and putting a lot of pressure on us to do so. Isn't this a bit like a shop saying everything must go as we are closing down, then not closing? And for a shop it wouldn't be legal. I personally have put my mortgage on the line to pass these tests before the end of this year and now I find out I don't have too. I was planning to pursue MCT when I had completed MCSE but I am now not going to pursue any more MC certs.

Tue, Nov 20, 2001 Dave UK

Sod the idea of using NT electives towards W2k, you should have W2k electives for W2k MCSE. A more realistic issue is: if the NT accreditation is to remain, why are the exams still retiring?

Mon, Nov 19, 2001 Andrew Houston, TX

I feel like Microsoft is discount the efforts I have accomplished to gain my MCSE and continue on to my W2K MCSE. Is Microsoft more concerned about turning out numbers than quality. My experience with countless paper MCSE's in the past has lead me to believe and my clients that MCSE does not mean anything anymore. Straighten up Microsoft, do not make this earned certificate to be trashed with a large number of unqualified people.

Thu, Nov 15, 2001 Vincent Florida

Yes, and those of us that went ahead and took all the W2K exams, passing them successfully, are left holding the bag. We receive absolutely no recognition for being able to pass these "more difficult" exams on the first attempt...

Thu, Nov 15, 2001 B.J. Calgary, Alberta

Why would they include 70-076 Exchange for 5, but not 70-081 Exchange for 5.5??

Thu, Nov 15, 2001 MAD NY

This pisses me off. Alot of consultants and administrators I have been talking to this year are scared to death to certify for 2000 because they know they will not pass the accelerated or full suite. My 2k certification actually had a little credibility once and for all. Now I am feeling like I wasted money again, and busted my hump for nothing. I enjoyed the challenge of the new tests and the fact that not just anyone could achieve MCSE on 2k. I attended class with 2 people with no prior experience. They failed miserably even using troytecs.

Wed, Nov 14, 2001 David Houston

Seems to me an awful lot of people out there are worried that someone else might have gotten something easier than they did or that it 'just isn't fair'. Well I have news for you! No one ever said life is fair. I just passed the 240 test the other day and now have only the 221 test to be certified on W2K and not use the electives that applied to my NT4 certification as I have taken more tests than just the minimum. This while having spent over half of this year laid up and unable to study because of cancer and chemotheropy. Maybe I should tell Microsoft that I need an extension due to health problems and that it is unfair trying to keep up with healthy people.

Tue, Nov 13, 2001 Frank San Diego, CA

I understand the Windows 2000 MCSE's being upset with the paper MCSE's but what makes them think that there are not "schools" out there that created Windows NT 4.0 Paper MCSE that have not upgraded there classes and are producing Paper 2000 MCSE's. The market is San Diego sucks because of them but I can not live under the illusion that the samething will not happen with 2000.

Tue, Nov 13, 2001 Jim Coronado

I am curious, has anybody heard anything about the MCSA and the 70-218 test? This is the test I need for that cert, but if it is not going to count towards my MCSE why should I take it?

Mon, Nov 12, 2001 WPJ Toronto, Canada

I think there are to many loosers out there that think they deservce the MCSE title, MS should have stuck by it and made you up grade, I did the Upgrade Exam and three Design Exams all in three days, it;s not that hard if you know what you are doing, get the flaming idiots out of our industry and give us the respect that we deserve. I also hold HP UNIX, Lotus, Gauntlet, Cisco and Compaq cerditations there not that hard if you knw what you are going. Get a life and quit bitchin'

Sat, Nov 10, 2001 Bill California

While I feel shafted by Microsoft, the best revenge is action. I am now certfying on Linux, and IT will be my prime recommendation to my future customers. Maybe Microsoft will listen then!!

Sat, Nov 10, 2001 cabdi idia

i wat to atke test exam

Sat, Nov 10, 2001 cabdi idia

i wat to atke test exam for oracle

Wed, Nov 7, 2001 McT UK

Ohhh! lots of people griping! and most about 'paper MCSE's ?? - are you dense? most every employer will see where you are in terms of ability and experience and then employ. It's nice having the qualifications but saying NT4 track should have been kept retired so we 2K MCSEs can shine and be great heroes proving our 2K abilities as better than what went before is quite sad. It all comes down to thinking that the 2K certificates actually make you better than NT4 MCSE'ers - they dont. They just mean you spent some time and money on studying - and typically with little real world experience (as 2K still isn't rolled out in the majority of sites.) So 2K MCSEs are actually more likely to be 'paper' than the majority of NT4'ers - who will, on average, have been certified for a some years with experience over that time.

Remember you are MCSE in NT4 or 2K so people are able to see what you took and when, and then they will ignore it as they test your actual ability not to dribble as you answer their interview questions.

Wed, Nov 7, 2001 Jim Russell Atlanta

Some of you pompous MCSE's seem to think that a piece of paper is what you are getting paid for, you are paid for your skills, not your cert's. Want a little cheese with that wine.

Tue, Nov 6, 2001 peter london

I think the decision to not kill the MCSE 4.0 but sperate it was correct as there is still a large need for NT 4.0 skills. the decision to allow the old NT 4 track electives in the Win2K track I believe is wrong as in my mind the network infrastructure exam was the old IP exam with AD and there are element of the IIS exam in the cores as well. The whiners have had well over a year to replace these as i have and bring there knowledge upto current standards. The bottom line is as several people have said experience counts more but as well as the piece of paper that says MCSE Peter MCP (since 1994), MCP+I,MCSE 4, MCSE 2000, CNE, CCNA, Compaq ACT + 8 years in the business

Mon, Nov 5, 2001 Wil San Clemente, CA

The thing that irks me is that before they decided not to retire the NT track- they had decided to add an NT 4.0 Support exam to the 2000 track as an elective with no credit for us NT MCSE's who have been supporting NT networks for a few years already!

Mon, Nov 5, 2001 pukoy Philippines

It's just alright if MS did that, Though NT 4 MCSE's stay (Paper MCSEs or Not). Wut matters is who can do d job when it comes to d real world. If they got d cert, let them, they passed d exam and it's not der fault if d exams r kinda weak. Wut matters now is dat when it comes to the field, d real MCSEs can do d job. If paper MCSEs mixed up der networks, der r always d real ones who can do d job. Well at least that leaves us something to do and earn from. rIGHT!

Mon, Nov 5, 2001 guru MCSE2k-charter member

WIMPS-just learn the new stuff or get lost!!!!

Mon, Nov 5, 2001 simon apsey England

Guys its time to stop complaining on Forums like this
I am one of those people who YES suffered fom the duplicity of Microsoft in there changes to the win2kMCSE rules but the only way to register your feelings with Microsoft is for eveyone to write,Email,fax,send a carrier pigeon to Microsoft and the press and the IT press about Microsofts complete disrespect for the people who play by Microsoft rules and then get treated with such obvious contempt.
Given microsoft's current problems with the US justice system the last thing they want is BAD publicity!!angryChange is brought about when we act together and tell them directly HOW WE FEEL!!!Maybe then we will get compensation for the extra cost and effort we put in playing by Microsoft rules

Fri, Nov 2, 2001 Ramasamy Madurai, India

I have been going through the posts here and in mcpmag.com website. A lot of people talk about paper MCSEs in their posts. I guess by referring paper MCSEs they mean MCSEs of inferior quality. Well, I just would like to know who these people are and what they think of themselves. Internet has been a source of information and anyone doing anything refer to the net for any useful information. It is those MCSEs paperless, who had put their exam experience on the net to pride themselves, are responsible for the so called paper MCSEs. Having said that no one takes the MCSE exams, just by referring to cramsessions etc. I do strongly disagree with this. Everyone needs to have hands on with NT products for them to succeed in the NT exams. I just wish to know whether the people who call others "paper MCSEs" are capable of rolling out OS's and writing programs that would change the the way the world functions. We all have taken certifications to enable us to market ourselves in a better manner. That's all and that's all the creator of this whole program wants. They want us to support their products with better knowledge. With this being the case do not try to throw mud on your fellow MCSEs. Grow up BOYS.. If you have something to say write an email to me. Thank You.

Fri, Nov 2, 2001 Don Simons Sacramento, CA

I know four Win2k MCSE's and two of them are paper without one day of real hands on experience. I have had my MCSE for over two years and am to damn busy solving real life problems and working on projects to re-certify this year. I do plan on upgrading my certification next year, however experience and ability counts in the real world not a piece of paper.

Fri, Nov 2, 2001 Usman Zaheer Pakistan

Thats not to bad that Microsoft has decided to add the retired exams of win nt 4.0 track as MCSE 2000 Elective

Thu, Nov 1, 2001 Mike Portland, OR

This is unbelievable. I though finally there would be some credibility with the W2K cert since it would weed out those dirtbag paper MCSE's. As an IT professional who has been in the industry nine years, I thought the W2K track would distinguish me again. But now all those paper MCSEs are going to be able to claim the W2K cert and keep the number of MCSEs high, flooding the market and reducing our salaries. The W2K elective exams are a lot more focused than the NT electives where, and they should be mandatory for the W2K cert. This is bad news.

Thu, Nov 1, 2001 Mike Chicago

I have been in IT for 15 years, and in all that time I have never run into any person who believes any certification (microsoft included) is worth anything. The ONLY thing that matters in the real world is experience, experience, experience.

Thu, Nov 1, 2001 Anonymous Anonymous

This is to all the cry bsbies out there that are saying that they should get their money back from Microsoft because they say taht they passed win 2k electives for nothing:

If you think that passing exams on the newest technologies is a waste of time then what the hell are you doing in the tech industry.... I deal with people like you all the time ...you know the ones who think that they are so good but in reality are just lazy and sit on their certification. If you want to be up to date then you do the exams and you pay otherwise shutup and stick to bullshitting your way with what you currently have.

Wed, Oct 31, 2001 Anonymous Anonymous

this is a good news and Microsoft do it right this time.
Although the product is discontinued, it is still in used for sometime in the market. So as to the certification should be still and fair for people whose is still supporting it.

Wed, Oct 31, 2001 Robert Atlanta

Microsoft is just a marketing company that has not contributed ANYTHING to the computing community except to put a computer in every home. When my MSCE for NT4 retires, I will not renew. Microsoft will not get anymore money from me. I have plenty of experience and will migrate customers to Linux. The internet is supposed to be a network where computers can exchange data, not a highway where you pay tolls to Microsoft.NET. Proof of their position on content was revealed with the new MSN.com site. Internet Explorer isn't the only web browser out there.

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 Thomas Ontario, Canada

OK. I got a letter from MS this summer saying the IIS 3 exam was retired and my MCSE was no longer valid. Does the new discontinued vs retired policy mean I'm an MCSE again?

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 Bob Florida

Personally I think that Microsoft has lost all integrity! One of the reasons that they initially decided to require MCSEs to upgrade was to help eliminate some of the paper MCSEs that are out here screwing up peoples networks. These people give all "professional" networking people a bad reputation. Microsoft should have stuck to their guns. We would all be better off in the long run.

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 Andrew Normal, IL

I'm glad things will be easier for the poeple upgrading to 2000 or who have already completed any of these retired exams. Don't you think their making this too easy? I'm proud of my MCSE (NT4 and 2000) because I know how much work and money I put into it. Soon there will be tons of MCSE's who didn't have to work as hard. Can you be proud in knowing that you didn't really do all the work? Do you even want a cert that is quickly loosing its credablility?

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 Thomas Los Angeles

As an old MCSE on NT40 with years of experience, I think we all deserve to have some of the NT40 electives count on the w2k MCSE track. It's true there are some paper MCSE out there, but give them a chance, we all have to start somewhere....Just because MS is doing this, does not means W2k track Certification a bad name,
experience is still speak for itself and what you can do hands on with the troubleshooting skills that matter.

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 JD Katy, Tx

I aggre with Paco from Germany, With MS the early bird (me) does get the shaft. I do like the idea of letting the NT 4 MCSE's keep their certifications (even though ther are more than a few paper MCSE's out there), but the W2K MCSE was supposed to be for W2K material and was supposed to be difficult (so it would mean something). Now a lot of old NT3.5/4 era electives will count, diluting the value of the new MCSE.
I thought the "stigma" of having an MCSE was going to go away, but it looks like I'll either drop it from my resume or listen to "Oh, another MCSE, no thanks, we want someone who knows what they are doing. . ."

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 BN TH

This is crazy due to Microsoft's irresponsibility toward read Win 2K MCSEs. The Win 2K Track is completely different than the Win NT 4.0 track. Therefore, counting these electives does not mean anything, only to bump up the current Win 2K MCSE titles only by NUMBERS.

This is another drastic mistake by Microsoft. It would have been muhc better for MS to furnish the following policy:

1. Win 2K Accelerated -- Pass it or pass as many exams as you can.

This is the key mistake miscrosoft made 1.5 years and it is paying price now.

Tue, Oct 30, 2001 Paco Germany

I do feel sorry for all those who busted their backsides on the W2K and I don't believe their efforts will be compensated. (all you can do is be proud in your achievement) On the other hand, I am very happy to hear that I only need to pass the 240 and one Design test to get my W2K. I guess, with Microsoft, the early bird does NOT get the worm....he gets the SHAFT!

Mon, Oct 29, 2001 Nick Quebec,CA

The "Windows 2000" article said it best: "MCSE, the certification game" ! Microsoft is selling software and training products, and we buy all that crap! In over ten years I went through so many versions that I can’t name them all. So for me, the hell with the funny MCSE and I keep my money for more RAM !

Mon, Oct 29, 2001 Patrick Malone MCP Association

The time has come to join together as group and stand up for our rights.
We need to create the "Microsoft Certified Professionals' Association". Please email me if you would like to help.

Mon, Oct 29, 2001 James Houston, Texas

After having taken 4 of the NT 4.0 MCSE exams Microsoft changed to the W2K. I never attempted the W2K exams because I feared the same fate ( time and money wasted).
I will now reconsider if I can get some credit for my preivous exams.

Mon, Oct 29, 2001 palash dhaka

yes if ms make nt server/workstation/enterprise elective. it would be great helpful for me.

Mon, Oct 29, 2001 Paul D. Memphis

Good Grief! What a bunch of whiny W2K wannabes.

News Flash people, you don't have the experience, all the certs in the world won't help. YOU WILL NOT GET A TOP JOB ON THE STRENGTH OF ANY PAPER CERTIFICATION.

That having been said, MS needs a certain credibility among EMPLOYERS, not techs. And cutting the number of MCSE's by 80% is not the way to convince an employer that you have a viable operating system. Remember, the employers don't have a ghost of a clue as to what makes the machine tick. So if its that much harder to find people who can work with W2K, then it must be that much harder to operate, right?

Yeah, I know, but that's the way HR people think.

Sun, Oct 28, 2001 Anonymous Anonymous

THIS IS GREAT NEWS!!!THIS WILL GREATLY HELP MCSE'S WITH NT CERTIFICATION USE THEIR CERTIFICATES TO GAIN EXPERIENCE AND GIVE THEM CONFIDENCE TO GIVE THE WIN 2K EXAMS.I AGREE WITH DUGGY FROM DUBLIN, THERE IS DEFINITELY NO SUBSTITUTE FOR XPERIENCE!!GOOD DECISION BY MICROSOFT.

Sat, Oct 27, 2001 Jonathan Michigan

I don't understand the negitive comments. It's a piece of paper. MS needs a ton of MCSEs 4.0 and 2000. MCSEs are the frontline salesforce of Microsoft network products. If you want to distinguish your exam path, note it on your resume. Hell, note your certification dates and exams. Demonstrate your individual achievents dont hate on others.

Sat, Oct 27, 2001 Todd Iowa

I will never bother to get another MS certification.
They have screwed all of us who worked to get the WIN2K MCSE.
It is now just as worthless as its predecessor.
Not only that but by allowing retired NT 4.0 exams to be used on the WIN2k track they have turned the MCSE in to nothing but a bad joke.
Whats next pull tabs on MC Donalds products to win free certification?

Sat, Oct 27, 2001 Bruce Boston

I think it's a sensible move. After all we have jobs to perform and cant always spend endless hours reading and studying to appease the whims of Microsoft.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Gerhard Germany

I am very very disapointed and somewhat happy at same time. If the those news are correct I´m also a MCSE2000 since today, but what are my efforts and time worth now, not to mention the turnaround of BillyBoys Company. I missed the Acc. Exam (had the opportunity to try it trice, because of troubles with the time counter !! each time!!). But I took the hard way and completed 5 Exams 210/15/16/17/19 just one lousy Exam left and now the credits for my certification are going down the drain.
Well fortunatly I´m CNE as well and Citrix CCA - those Certs are really a backup to prove your credability as an IT-Pro.
Maybe next week one can see another anouncement of MS that you have to take an additional elective covering XP and then there will be MCSE´s NT4 MCSE´s 2000 (NO-XP) and MCSE´s 2000 with XP and don´t forget the +I Ext.
I guess there has to be a new MS-course for Employers to be informed when the hire an new Employee for their company.
Cheers!
Gerhard

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Jim LA

I am very disappointed with Microsoft. I understand their logic, but for those of us that went out of our way to pass the tests so we would not loose our cert, it is a slap in the face. I would like to see Microsoft distinguish between the W2k MCSE and the NT MCSE. One thing I am glad though is that the NT tests are not coming out of retirement...yet.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 TheEntierpriseSpeaks CA

Good! Way too many companies are barely going to windows2K. Jobs that are out there require WINNT4.0 with WINNT2K. When WINNT4.0 is obsolete from the Enterprise (like WIN95 is now)- that is when WINNT4.0 should not be credited to MCSE.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Charlie Baltimore, MD

INCREDIBLE! In the words of the infamous Emily Latilla (from Sat. Night Live)-- Never Mind! Just like that Microsoft bows to the whiners - after, of course, I have worked an enormous amount of hours and spent a large sum of money on my Win2K MCSE. Could someone please tell me whom do I contact for my refund? I wonder if the Justice Dept. whines a little more will MS agree to a break up?

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Kent DesMoines, IA

Well for all the other ppl who passed the electives, you can rest assured yours, like mine, Win2k MCSE early adopter cards will give you the leg up in any interview. Should proxy server 1.0 elective really be valid for obtaining Win2k cert?

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Christian Bergeron Quebec,CA

I enjoyed the fact that MS was taking some action to eliminate a lot of the 'MCSE paper'. But my joy had a short life when I realised that by including 'old' NT 4.0 certifications in the MCSE 2000 Track we were back in the past. I'm a MCT, giving W2K courses and what is often mentionned is that the MSCE certification is overestimated. Because there is a lot of MCSE that just don't know IT! And there is, now and more than ever, more companies that reject MCSE's candidates because of that really and very bad reputation. I'm really serious about that!

The comments I've heard about the W2K track was that MS was doing a real good job about regaining real respect about their certifications. But today... Do you realise that maybe the MCT in front of you will be able to give W2K courses event if is knowledge of W2K is very poor. It's not fiction, it's reality! Still, I acclaim the MCSA certification. It's a very good thing. Hope you understand my points. Thank you.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Vipul Shah Maryland

Wow!!. Now I have to only take 2 exams to get my MCSE for Widows 2000 i.e. if I pass the Accelerated exam. I can use my TCP/IP and IIS towards my electives. This is a great news. Thank you MS. Anyone please correct me if I have misunderstood. You can send me an email. Thank you.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Chris Denver

I sat and watched for years as loser after loser went and simply regurgitated for their 4.0 MCSE, then finally the 2k MCSE track makes the effort and cost worth it... AND now MS goes and devalues the whole darn thing all over again. I guess I shouldn't have wasted my money on this cert either.. looks like there will be thousands and thousands of 4.0 posers getting their 2k MCSE the easy way.. again devaluing the whole MS cert process!

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Matt Madison, WI

Its about time. That just cut my number of update exams from 4 to 2 (assuming I pass the monster exam. These are still valuable skills, but as they say.... Certification is one thing and experience is another.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Rae Rockville,MD

I absolutely agree with Paul. I have been certified since 1997 and it has always been a personal pursuit to better myself and to increase my knowledge. I have obtained my CSA for Solaris 7 and am beginning my studying for the Cisco track as well as working on the RH Linux track. No one is forcing or encouraging me for that matter. My chosen career path is self-directed and it is up to me to stay marketable and skilled.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Daryl Texarkana

The toughest part of the Win2k cert was those stupid case study electives. Now the business world will not be able to distinguish those of us who busted our *** and put in the effort to fight our way through the deal from the whimps. We gave up a part of our lives to make the mark and now are being thrown to the dogs.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Paul Baltimore, MD

I can see both sides of the issue. First I'm glad that MS realized that NT 4 is still a viable OS and isn't going to pasture any time soon. Secondly, from a professional stand point I see it as my responsibility to stay current on technology. No one is making me take certs. It's a personal decision that has professional benefits. The more current my skill set, the more marketable I am. MS and any Vendor can do whatever they want, but I'm still going to continue to better myself.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Julio Little Rock

I believe Microsoft made the right choice to allow NT 4.0 electives to be used towards the 2000 track. I know of no company (probably not even MS) that is only using 2000 or NT4. The norm is a mixture of both. To those MCSE's who are angered at MS for the choices they make concerning the cert requirements can easily remove the cert from their resumes and seek jobs that don't require it.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Tonya Lexington Park, MD

One of MS articles states, "Individuals who earned the MCSE certification on Windows NT 4.0 by February 28, 2001, remain certified, contrary to previous announcements." What about those who have obtained certification after Feb 28, 01?

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Trey NC

It's like taking a full cup of ice, filling it only half full of tea, and letting the ice melt before you drink it. MS has diluted the program beyond belief now. The main reason I upgraded to 2K was because 059 and 087 were retired from the beginning. This is one of the biggest certification disappointments I have ever faced. I will NOT certify on MS again. Everyone who upgraded to W2K should boycott MS certifications.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Greg Midwest, USA

SHAME, SHAME, SHAME on you, Microsoft!!! I'm an MCSE on Windows 2000 now and I spent a phenominal amount of time getting there. Microsoft never should have recinded the MCSE expiration. The problem is, they SUCCEEDED in what they wanted to do -- make the MCSE meaningful again. All the paper MCSEs were about to expire. Now, not only will they keep the ability to use the "MCSE" title, but some of the WEAK exams are being allowed to count towards MCSE 2000. I've passed the SQL 6.5 Admin exam -- those skills are highly outdated compared to SQL 2000 -- it SHOULD be retired.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Microsoft will "re-retire" these exams in another 6 months... so they won't continue to count towards the MCSE 2000 certification. Or maybe Microsoft will get smart and just decertify the MCSE on NT 4.0 in another year. No matter what, they've really blown this whole thing. They should have stuck to their guns -- IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE TOUGH!

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 Ali Motiwala London

This is a good news but far too late to the people who alrady had spent so much money to do get Win2K certification.

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 duggy Dublin,Irl

No matter what exam you pass, there is no substitute for experience !!

Fri, Oct 26, 2001 duggy Dublin,Irl

No matter what exam you pass, there is no substitute for experience !!

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Walter Salt Lake

So Microsoft wimps out on the W2K cert by caving in to the whining of the losers that can't pass the W2K exams. Color me shocked. NOT!

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Karen Boise, ID

Joel, This is good to know. I was going to say "Forget it" to the Win2k re-cert (too much time and money after shelling out $600 on NT last year), but am now thinking it may be worth it if I can use 70-059 and 70-087.

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Joel Tucson, AZ

Lisa,
The electives that counted for your NT4 MCSE do count towards the W2K MCSE even though they were used to get the NT4 MCSE. I got my W2K MCSE using the same two electives that were used to satisfy my NT4 MCSE.

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Noah Tampa, FL

So what about all of the saps that busted their duffs and budgets on the Win2k electives. What "Just sorry about your luck"? I think we should have money coming back to us. I know that I certainly would have not spent the extra dough just for being able to say I took all the Win2k exams.

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Brandon Thomas Kissimmee Florida

Who is This CertCities.com Editor Becky Nagel that contributed to this report. Is she real or is she a product of the CIA's MK Ultra ?????? Why does she have no toe prints??

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Boris GENEVA

For me it's just a bit late because i've allready done 70-227, and scheduled 70-223 for 31 of october... i mean why the hell are thoses stuff always changing and changing and changing. I'm sorry but for me this certification as completely loosed any credibility... Down in Europe we think twice before jumping but i'm confident you'll learn once !

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Anonymous Anonymous

If I take a novell test can I apply it to all microsoft certifications, or just a few??

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Lisa Alaska

Can electives counted toward a previous MCSE also be counted toward the 2000 MCSE???

Thu, Oct 25, 2001 Chad Deason

That would be extremely nice if 70-067, 70-068, and 70-073 would be counted also. I started with these exams and switched to the Win2k exams and I have taken six Win2k exams and lack one elective. If 70-079 is counted then the above mentioned NT exams should be too.
Chad Deason, MCP

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