In-Depth

The Best & Worst of Windows 2000

The AD Revolution

My Favorite Toy

How can I isolate just one feature? That’s like trying to pick my favorite toy after Santa has left me with a roomful. I’m sure most people agree that the addition of Active Directory will completely revolutionize the way that medium to large enterprises work with Microsoft networking technology. But I think the power of Windows Script Host (WSH) combined with the AD Services Interface (ADSI) will make a major change in the way that many of us administer the network environment. Using GUIs for configuration changes and user maintenance is incredibly time-consuming, so being able to create and run scripts that can do this will make huge differences in productivity.

Therefore, I think we’ll see more and more MCSEs venture into system programming the same way that our Unix brethren do now. Since ADSI includes providers for NetWare NDS, NetWare bindery, and NT 4.0 domains, this could mean that heterogeneous network administration can be done from the same place using the same scripts. I don’t think it’s an accident that this technology has been available for download for the past couple years—I think Microsoft wanted as many as possible to be familiar with it before Win2K was released.

And don’t forget to check out the new CD Player program—it looks great and can optionally download the names of each song on the CD.

More Trouble than it’s Worth

I know Microsoft has a reputation for innovation in user interface design and for extensive usability testing, but I think the Personalized Menu feature is more trouble than it’s worth. Thank goodness it’s easily turned off without requiring us to go directly to the Registry.

Also, I hate to sound like an old fogy, but I’m not a fan of the “Windows 2000” name. I still prefer “Windows NT,” but I guess Microsoft didn’t have me in mind when it made that decision.

And finally, a feature I wish Microsoft would implement now. The more I work with Linux, the more I like it. No, I’m not predicting that Linux will soon take over the known world, but it can have a place. In particular, it can make use of older server hardware that doesn’t meet Win2K’s minimum (recommended) requirements. So, I wish that Microsoft would work to reduce the hardware required for Win2K and not automatically assume that IT managers want to keep buying newer and bigger PC servers just because their NOS of choice requires it.

About the Author

Greg Neilson is a manager at a large IT services firm in Australia and has been a frequent contributor to MCPmag.com and CertCities.com.

comments powered by Disqus

Reader Comments:

Thu, Mar 27, 2008 Anonymous Anonymous

74cfed88ad26a08c664dd006703e0069

Tue, Mar 25, 2008 Anonymous Anonymous

f3bff1efdb027a4c66f169729a77d83e

Sun, Jun 3, 2007 Anonymous Anonymous

I am taking the exam...whether it helps me or not...but i wish it helps me!

Sun, Oct 2, 2005 Midlife Crisis northeast

I wanna move back home with my mommy and watch cartoons. Being an adult is really tough. Plus I want to make 100,00.00 without having to get more that 2 certs. Is that possible?

Tue, Jun 14, 2005 no name;just a number Louisville

I have an MCSE in 2k and 2k3 with 8 years in IT- currently at 68k in Louisville KY- Cert's dont mean s*** if you cant do the job- ie; you braindump it will come back to get you

Mon, May 23, 2005 Anonymous Anonymous

I'm an MCP and have worked doing phone hardware troubleshooting and diagnostics with Customers on the phone for 5+ years on HP Proliant and Netservers -- I don't even make $40,000 a year! I make $16.99 per hour, which is chump change

Thu, Apr 28, 2005 Nyce Guy Anonymous

I see once more that Microsft has failde miserably with the MCT certification. Instead of it being like a CCIE - Top level cert, it is relegated to a demeaning - oH, they only teach. Nonsense, but just as well. Microsoft now allows anyone with a desktop cert become an MCT, so I refuse to pay for the cert anymore, MCSE, MCSEI, MCPI, MCP, and more - deploying the largest Windows server migration in History, and Oh, yes, still teaching part time.

Mon, Mar 21, 2005 Anonymous Anonymous

I happen to review a number of individual posts – However – There are still many factual pieces of information missed – Here within the Washington, D.C. Metro area.

1000’s of IT professionals were unemployed for up to one year.
Many have left the field all together – Some have returned as the economy has shifted.

Nevertheless many IT professional will never be able to return to work after they are placed through a rigorous background check where ones credit is being reviewed by to being hired.

If you have been out of work for a substantial period of time, how could your credit be anything other then destroyed?

In addition to being out of work for a period of time, the interviewing process is no longer professional – It is a grill session where you better be able to sell yourself in 5 min or less.

You are placed into a room with your fellow IT professional that are lucky enough to still be employed and asked questions that one would require a knowledge based to be able to answer the majority of them correctly.

I have been an IT professional for 15 years and honestly – I am trying to find another career field.

Tue, Jan 11, 2005 peter Anonymous

I think you are right!!!

Thu, Dec 30, 2004 Clint Anonymous

I would be curious as to how cost of living plays into this. In the Redmond-Bellevue area where 400k for a 3 bedroom home and tiny property is normal, making a 60k salary there is quit different then some place like Memphis. (According to Realitor.com, a 60k salary in Redmond, WA is equal to making just over 40k in Memphis, TN)

Sun, Dec 5, 2004 Nuno Portugal

I am dreaming. I am mcse, mcsa w2k my salary it's abaut 9600€ year...
No comment's at all...

Mon, Nov 15, 2004 Brian Philadelphia

I think you need the Certifications and the experience. I have been in the industry for 15 years. I have let my Certifications expired but I went to grad school to get my Master's in Information Science. I believe the MSIS will pay off in the long run, but now I will go back and get re-certified in . Salaries in Philly are all over the place. I turned down an offer for 50000 a year, but hooked up with a company that will pay me 60000. Also, Employers are more picky with the additional influx of IT Talent. So, the HR & IT Teams are looking for organizational fit and ability to work with others in a team. I have heard stories of IT Talent bucking the the Department and getting pink slips.

Wed, Oct 27, 2004 whatup Anonymous

Is Luke Edson really a CCIE? His website states CCIE (written routing and switching exam). It's my understanding that you must pass both the written and lab exams to become a CCIE, with the lab exam being much more challenging than the written. Also if he has a CCIE cert why not have the icon from Cisco stating so on his website? He has the others posted there. No doubt his expertise is beyond question, just wondering if his statement of certs is misleading.

Thu, Sep 23, 2004 Anonymous Anonymous

In Toronto Microsoft subcontracts out call center positions for MS Exchange at $17.40 per hour. To have that level of product knowledge and make little shows how far the numbers in the survey are off.

Wed, Sep 22, 2004 Jon Indiana

MCP, NPlus, APlus, LPlus, 4 yrs exp - I am working in a job arena I love - small shop admin. I take care of anything and everything from wireless installation to help desk. My pay is only 32,000 plus bonuses and half rent compensation. I wouldn't trade it for the world. I walk 50 ft to work, live in a small quiet rural community where I don't have to lock my doors. I think it is a trade-off. this is where I have always wanted to be and it is where I am. Certs don't equal a good work initiative or attitude - that is what it takes to make it in this industry.

Mon, Sep 20, 2004 cspanburgh@scg.net San Diego

Congrads fellow forum member on the write up. As for the low salary IT positions, ask yourselves how much it would cost your company to have someone come in from outside and do your job. What about the "Fires" that erupt. What if they had to pay a consultant to come in and do your job.

How much would it cost them. In the boom years Cisco Security people were getting $2,200 a day. Oracle DBAs are still getting over 300 an hour in some shops. What if you did Exchange troubleshooting for $150 an hour.

I hope you see what I mean. Basic network managment is perceived as "easy". We know it is not, but if the perception is "Easy" the company will not pay much. So, what really hard Cert are you going to go for. What Skill are you going to aspire too that others feel is too hard?

We all know that the new test are not easy. So I think that Luke deserves our respect for setting an example for us.

Just my too cents.

See you at MR&D Luke.

Wed, Sep 8, 2004 Luke Edson Texas

OverTheEdge- Yep, I don't list them all when I write, especially in my email sig., just the three core ones. Of course, in a resume, they're all listed, as they look good in HR (or new consulting gigs), but in my case, you look like an a.. if they're all listed. There's no quicker way to turn me off, like someone who goes around showing off all his "alphabet soup"! :) - I look at certs as one way of setting myself apart from others on paper, but if you can't do the work, you look a lot more stupid! I've come across too many paper certs in my day, & you need to be able to prove you can get the job done right! (The first time around always helps!). :) - It is definitely one way that I stay on top of stuff, as if I don't take a test every couple of months, decertification becomes an issue!! - I was pleasantly surprised to have made the issue, we'll see what comes of it, as I'm surprised how low other's salaries are. - Oh yes, I don't have kids! :)) - But I am an avid sports (yes, some extreme ones too) participant, & I have learned that you've gotta have a balance in life, - if work is extreme, make play time that way too! The key to happiness! - www.edsontech.com

Wed, Sep 8, 2004 Bill Chicago

I agree with the first 2 Anonymous comments. I work for a large outsourcing IT company and these reports seem to be way off. Just check out the jobs on the boards for this area, and the ones who are nice enough to post a salary range show 35 - 40K is what they're looking to pay. I've been looking for something closer to home for over a year now, but I just cant justify the drop from 50+ down to 30+. I have the degree, the certs and the experience but as soon as you tell them your salary they back down.

Wed, Sep 8, 2004 MCSE Anonymous

It's interesting that the 2004 Salary Stats show that "No Microsoft Certification" posts a better salary than most certified categories! Could it be that many in that category are supervisors or have been in the field long before certifications appeared and feel like they don't need certification and therefore don't think anyone else should either. I have seen it everywhere when applying for a job - experience weighs way more than any certification, especially when those interviewing you are not certified. It's been my experience that certifications also have little to do with salary increases from year to year.

Mon, Sep 6, 2004 pete405 Anonymous

OverTheEdge- It is fine to sit on that high horse when you already have a job. The fact is that those without a job have to first get past the HR screeners. Giving people a hard time about how they present their credentials in a resume just shows how long it has been since you've had to get one past HR to someone with half a clue.
The hardest part of getting hired today for someone with real skills is getting to an interview with someone able to tell the difference between a talker or "paper tech" and a capable technician.

Thu, Sep 2, 2004 OverTheEdge Boston

Luke Edson's certification string highlights a problem for folks who pursue multiple, high-level certs: how do you present them without looking silly?
First of all, shame on anyone who lists, for example, a CCIE and then goes on to list something like a CCNA (I'm not directing that specifically at Luke, who very well may not actually list his certs that way on his correspondence, but I have seen plenty of people who do exactly that in real life). Same goes for other tiered certs - my rule: list the highest level cert acheived within each technology space (which would mean not only don't list an MCP along with your MCSE, but likewise don't list a Server+ cert if you're an MCSE).
The other - trickier - problem is presenting things like the multiple MCSE certs. Microsoft is partially responsible for this mess for caving in and allowing people to remain MCSEs in good standing even if the last exam they took was an NT 4.0 Server exam back in 1997 or something, thus necessitating the versioning of MCSE certs to distinguish those MCSEs who keep up to date. There's still the specialist suffix issue, though. I think the best way to present it would be MCSE: Security/Messaging (4.0/Win2K/Win2K3) (I'm not sure if my slashes are going to appear on-screen...)
Bottom line in my view: Keep it as simple as possible, and keep to the high ground. Show me the whole scope of your (pertinent) knowledge, but don't drown me in redundant or useless alphabet soup. If you have higher-level certs, don't include lower-level certs unless they actually add value to your knowledge scope. If you tell me you're an MCSE and an MCSA, I'm going to conclude that you are focused on the certs, not on the knowledge behind them, and I'm going to have a hard time taking you seriously.
For the curious, my alphabet soup: MCSE (4.0/Win2K/Win2K3), MCNE (4/5/6), CCNA, CISSP, PMP

Thu, Sep 2, 2004 Anonymous Anonymous

I filled out the survey. I'm actually making 4000 more than the average person with my certs, so I guess I shouldn't complain to have a good full time job in NY. I'd gladly trade more than 4000 to be happy at my job, which I'm not. Here's hoping we can all find a good balance between wealth and happiness in life and with our work.

Thu, Sep 2, 2004 Anonymous Anonymous

I have tried to get on this survey for years and never make it. They just pick the cream of the crop. I have mcse, mcsa, several comptia,and ccna and I barely make $30K in rural tennessee. Certs are worthless in this area. If I can get on in Nashville I will probably jump $20K, but I can't catch on anywhere. With 4 years experience and certs it is still hard to find good work.

Thu, Sep 2, 2004 Anonymous Anonymous

Hello
It is discouraging to keep reading salary surveys here which seems not too many reports reflect the reality out there in the industry. The examples displayed here are folks with number of years of experience and high level of cert working at elaborate companies. Could you please display some low level IT Tech examples that would encourage people that there is still hope for bright future for some with lesser salary earnings and lower certs. Please do not make these reports look as if things are so far out of reach it keeps people wondering and worried about this field.
Thank you

Thu, Sep 2, 2004 Steve Z Sacramento, CA

The Average Base Salary by Certification chart and the comments under chart 3 give the impression that maybe certifications aren't necessary...until you need to GET a job. Then there's a world of difference - even with experience.

Mon, Aug 30, 2004 Bill Springfield, IL

Does edson have children?

Wed, Feb 11, 2004 A+, MCSE, MCDBA, MCSA Seattle,WA

Start off by getting your A+, NET+ certifications. Then go for the MCSA. Showing up with an MCSE on your resume with no experience is an indicator to the employer that you might not be up to speed with what an Engineer might know. And by all standards, you're not by default because of non existent experience. It has been my experience through conducting interviews and being interviewed that certifications show that you're trying to stay current with industry standards and that you're willing to go the extra mile on your own. These are qualities that all employers initially want. They won't guarantee you a job, but they'll get you into the door for an interview.

Tue, Feb 3, 2004 Student VA Beach

I am a Second semester sophmore who is an MIS major. Currently I am confused on what I am going to be doing after I graduate. My supervisor suggests that I get my MCSE Win2k just to start out. Is this a good idea? If not please help me out. Thank you!

Tue, Jan 27, 2004 Anonymous SF Bay Area

I am a very infrequent visitor to this section. If I actually believed the salary surveys posted here I would never bother to certify with Microsoft. MCPMag's surveys are nothing short of demoralizing in that department.
Those surveys are no doubt taken from FTE's with a very low self-esteem and plenty of time to take part in such things. Perhaps their earnings might be better if they stoped spending their time at this site, and opened a book or two - gained some wicked skills, and stepped into the contracting/consultants arena.

Tue, Jan 20, 2004 Jose Pedraza Melbourne, Florida

Once of the comment the end user is complaining on MCP MAG's editorial staff justify their own existence and (I'm sure) overpaid positions. Well, in reality I am an example of an MCSE 2003, MCDBA, MCSA, MCSD that is making that salary range. Nevertheless, the company also have rewarded with a
$ 17K bonus this year. Is just depend on the skills and workload.

Thu, Jan 8, 2004 MCDBA, MCSE, MCSA, CCNA North Alabama

Someone thin out the gene pool! You spoiled little brats! I've been in this industry for 20 years. I too got hit by the economic crash. I went almost 2 years without a full time job. Sure, I worked some temp gigs and small consulting jobs myself, but there were zero jobs. After all I went through, my experience, certifications and attitude have gotten me a great job and a better-than-average salary for this area. Work hard, work smart, learn and be willing to do any job and do it well. That's the bottom line.

Tue, Dec 9, 2003 Dave RTP, NC

It has been hard here in North Carolina. I took a large paycut last June. I was out of work for 6 months. Now I make less teaching than I made before I became a MCSE. Things may be looking up.

Sat, Nov 22, 2003 Dale (MCP, MCSE, Net+, MO florida

I have to say the economy does hurt our motivations. I am a college student working on my major in Information Technology, working part-time for a large company as a tech-support representative (on the phones). I work very hard at what I do and I have to say I am one of the best Reps on the floor. I continue to get all the certifications that I can get not necessarily for the money but for the knowledge(my hard work will pay off). I love what I do! I do a lot of side-jobs that I charge anywhere for 65 to 85 dollars per hour setting up LAN/WAN/VPN networks and building personnel PC and Business servers. Despite the bad economy I continue to make it work for me. I know it’s hard for everyone out there but who ever said it was going to be easy! MAKE it work for your self. It seems that most if not ALL employers are looking for someone that is experience and not just certified. So, go out there and get the EXPERIENCE and with the certification can make you a very valuable person (looks good on resume). I currently have two jobs plus going to college, it’s hard. But I can say that after I am done with college, I will have the experience and Certs to make it happen for me. My Conclusion: keep your head up, smile, get the experience (side jobs), and continue to get your certifications. DON’T let the bad economy put you down.

Mon, Nov 10, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

In fact, HK I.T. professional never get this salary rate in their life.

Mon, Nov 3, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I think the salary survey is pretty accurate. I have two jobs in IT (Network Architect during the day; Trainer at night) and both salaries are right-on. I make a little under $150k/year but I work my tail off - that means willingly taking on the good and bad jobs the boss has, professional development at my cost and time, and attitude. I’m also well connected to the community because of my teaching job, and I do see quite a range of IT salaries reported from my students. The biggest discriminator (and the one that MCPMag can't measure) are those hard work and attitude variables. Just remember keep at it and that hard work and a great attitude will prevail in the long run – maybe not this year but sometime in the future.

Thu, Oct 30, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I saw some of the figures and thought.... man is he getting robbed. If we settle for minumun wage, you will get it. We as professional have to set the standard and not accept just anything. Oh yeah, and with that the professional test takers will be exposed one way or another... it just a matter of time

Mon, Oct 13, 2003 Carl R, MCSE-2K, CCNA, MC Des Moines, IA.

Brian and Bob hit it on the head!!! It isn't about the haves and the have nots. It's about the attitude, desire and drive!! As a 7yr. IT professional with some management experience, I can tell you that the people with the sour grapes attitudes get a sour grapes review, which goes hand in hand with a poor salary.
I feel my certifications along the way have helped me get my foot in the door (the interview). My Attitude, desire and drive got me the job, not my certifications.
2 yrs. ago, I was making around 45K as a consultant in St. Louis, MO. I left that to take a job as an Instructor at a small college in Fenton. I kept that job, because it honed my skills, and kept me current with technology. I went to an IT job fair at the Convention Center, and lo and behold, there were 3 vendors there!!! I left my resume with all three, even though the third one told me up front that they were NOT hiring, and wouldn't be for 18 months!! Guess what happened??? That's right, that company called me back 3 montha ago, and asked me up for an interview!! Why? Because they remembered how upbeat I was. My ATTITUDE was fantastic. I took that job offer, moved to Des Moines, and can now say that yes, the salary survey is right on the money!! Get a grip, and wake up!! If you want to achieve success, you gotta present a complete package........Skills, proof, experience, attitude, desire and drive!!!!

Thu, Oct 9, 2003 Brian S, MCSE, MCDBA Seattle,WA

I've been looking at the surveys for the past five years and it's the same comments over and over again. On one hand, one could conclude that if that many IT professionals were in dispute of mspmag's findings; that mcpmag might have bad data. Then again, I know quite a few people in the industry that like myself, can report that the survey is dead on. Having said that, I think it could also be said that surveys in general can only be accurate for those that agree with them...

Don't get me wrong, I too HAD a low paying salary starting out and I felt like I was under paid as most people do, but like Bob in St Louis, I have been always pushed myself to go to school and read books to increase my knowledge. Getting the certifications, gaining experience, and moving from one opportunity to another has proved to be the winning combo to increasing my salary. I also believe that hard work, being at work early, and relentless dedication to the task at hand will win over your employer and take you just as far if not further than office politics. As a result, my salary has increased every year.

I can no longer say "I've never seen so much bickering and complaining in all of my life" because I see it year after year when the survey comes out. After reading all of the posts here, I have once again come up with a few solutions for everyone who's got a gripe about the way things are going for them:

1. If you're not making enough money, find another job in another city or profession.
2. If you upset about paper MCSE's watering down the industry, don't get certified.
3. If your bickering about salaries posted in the survey, don't read them.
4. If you didn't post your salary and are complaining about the salaries, slap yourself.
5. If you've posted that your grossly over-paid, slap yourself.
6. 5. If you've posted that your grossly under-paid, slap yourself.
7. If I haven't listed something, insert comment here ____________, then slap yourself.

Stop blaming mcpmag and claiming that everyone participating in the survey is lying. It's that kind of mindset that keeps you stuck on stupid in complaint mode.

Mon, Oct 6, 2003 Bob Feldsien, MCSD MCDBA St Louis, MO

First, let me acknowledge that I got into the IT field at the right time. I started in 1997, when if you knew anything at all, someone would eventually give you a job.
I began getting certifications right from the beginning, and they have proved to be invaluable to me both in terms of landing interviews and in actually developing marketable skill sets.
That said, let me say that my most valuable asset is my work ethic. I show up on time, work diligently, avoid office politics, and deliver quality work ahead of time.
As a result, I enjoy an income in the top 10% of programmers nationwide, am well-respected in the IT community, and thoroughly enjoy my work.
There is always plenty of work for those who develop the right skills and apply them earnestly. The rest of you can continue to whine if it makes you feel better. Better yet, you can find a less demanding line of work.

Mon, Oct 6, 2003 Anonymous Ft. Wayne, Indidan

I am an MCSA working in health care IT in indiana, and I can tell you I wish I made as much as those figures. I am a network analyst and don't make anything NEAR those figures!!! Network Analyst at my company is a server/systems level administrator and I can get NO higher without getting into management!!

Wed, Oct 1, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I second Glarb from Orlando's assertion that one should seriously question the integrity of the publishers and editors of MCP Magazine. I firmly believe that this salary survey is disreputable, deceitful, and borderline fraudulent. Shame on all concerned...

Mon, Sep 22, 2003 Glarb Orlando

This salary survey is complete and total bullshit. I hate to say it folks. The survey shows an average of over $50,000 a year for Orlando. Well I'm in Orlando, and I am here to tell you that there aren't any IT jobs here. Maybe if you have retained employment from previous years you're still getting the money, but if you try to jump ship, you'll hit rock bottom. Do a search on Monster for IT jobs in Florida, and you will find very few IT listings. Sometimes more than a week will go by without ANY listing at all. The last Monster listing for an MCSE I saw advertised a rate of only $12 an hour. I really wonder about this survey? It just boggles the mind. The survey doesn't even mention the impact H-1B, L1, and outsourcing have had on IT salaries and on job availability. Not ONE word. I correspond with people all over the country, and nobody, and I mean NOBODY, believes what MCP Mag is publishing. I question the integrity of the publishers, and honestly, I always expected better from Dian.

Tue, Aug 19, 2003 Chris Germany

Please stop confussing poeple with your salary scale, all are very big lies, there are no jobs and meager salaries all over.

Tue, Aug 19, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I was recently offered a job paying half of what my salary demands are (with all/more responsibility of any job I've had in IT). The hiring manager pulled out this issue/article in attempt to justify the low offer. It's obvious that these numbers on the surface are of little use. I happily said "no thanks". Consider it taking one for our side. I will not be a part of bringing the IT salaries down to rediculous levels. Then again, I'm not drowning in debt.

Tue, Aug 12, 2003 G SE U.S.

I agree with Bel, to some extent, that POLITICS do play a major role in what one receives as compensation. Your ability to be able to "negotiate" your pay as well as "prove" your worth to a company is what's going to put the green in your pocket. I don't care what cert you hold or from how many different companies (Microsoft, Novell, Cisco, Citrix, etc)... bottom line is, when it's time to put out the fires, you have to be able to step up and do your job. I'm currently an IT Director and have been in IT for 8 years. I hold a 2 year degree and have only an A+ cert. I refuse to get my other cert's as I've already proven my abilities and because I know that no matter how many I have, it's never going to change my bottom line (especially in this economy). I've hired MCSE's in the past who've had "no clue" how to solve simple issues when they arrived. I'd hire a person with 2-4 years of OJT in IT over an MCSE w/o field experience all day long, and twice on Sunday's. Why? Because there is no substitute for actually doing what needs to be done (not just having read about it in some tech manual). Unfortunately, the MCSE title just doesn't hold any merrit anymore (as well as most other certs). With 2-week bootcamps and cram session tech schools spitting them out as fast as they can, how can the title actually mean anything? Personally, as a manager, I place "zero" weight on certifications. Companies created the "90-day probationary period" for a reason, and this is it... so show me what you "REALLY" know...! For the record, I make $61k at a non-profit company, so the survey was pretty much right on for me.

Sun, Aug 10, 2003 Ben SE Texas

I am stuck as a contractor for a very large company who lowballs. I've been wanting to leave this Hell hole since I arrived two years ago. I'm an MCP with 4 years experience making 36k no benifits. Not bad, but could be way better. But, it beats flipping burgers for minimum wage.

Sun, Aug 10, 2003 Anonymous Chicago

I have been in te IT industry for about 7 years and currently work for a large, Fortune 500 company. My salary is 70K a year (and here in the Chicago area, that means a lot). I am currently an MCP going for my MCSE but that's not what got me the job (I only got the MCP last month!). I think that what one the earlier posters eluded to about soft skills is perfectly right. One needs to be able to communicate effectively if they're to be seen as a serious candidate (remember - it's not an interview, it's a sales pitch!!) Also, I see a lot of posts about jobs being outsourced (not programming jobs going overseas but local outsourcing). It's not a bad idea to become a contractor yourself (I agree... it's not for everyone). I've seen a few jobs on the job sites (monster, hotjobs, dice) from companies that contract out people to large companies for support work, etc. Lastly, I have noticed in the IT world, job concentration seems to move from city to city. Now, there are always jobs to be had (albeit far fewer in number, now) in big cities like New York and Chicago but hot spots like Silicon Valley have cooled down but Washington DC seems to have picked up. I guess if you are willing to pick up and move, you are far more likely remain employed (again, I know this is not an option for many).
These are just my 2 cents worth and may or may not make sense to anyone. I do wish the best for all here who are looking for work. Hopefully, the economy can't get much worse than this and our industry's ranks will rise once again!

Fri, Aug 8, 2003 Anonymous SoCal(LA)

If your job can be done cheaper, it will be done cheaper. That holds true for industry and government. I have over twenty-nine years working for the Federal government. I am a domain administrator, run a help desk and help manage Exchange. I make about 70K per year, but guess what? Federal jobs are being commercialized, which means they will go to the lowest bidder. Now keep in mind that over 50% of all Federal IT workers WILL retire within the next five-ten years and you can see where this is going. There is no security. I barely made it and once I retire there is nothing on the 'outside' for me. Younger IT workers just entering this field have my sympathy. I would not want to be in their shoes.

Fri, Aug 8, 2003 Anonymous Silicon Valley, CA

These salary figures are grossly exagerated. If you watched Silicon Valley Business News last weekend, they said tech salaries in the valley have plunged in the last year.Unemployment is over 8%.The tech jobs sites confirm this, take a look at DICE.com.If you are lucly enough to get an offer, its less than $20/Hr for Tech Support and $25/Hr for Net Admin.

Fri, Aug 8, 2003 John New York

I would like to add a comment. I have my A+ and MCP certifications and i've been in the buisness for a little over 1.5 years. I talk to many techs in the field from across the country and none of them agree with these salary scales. If there are people starting with no experience making 40-45K they are the very few. These people should not be the examples of the rest of us. One salary figure that is to high will distort the whole range of figures. Someone should also break down the salary scales by region (east coast , west ect.) to give a more acurate sense of dollars. I know that by having more experience your worth more but if you notice, the scales have years not experience.

Fri, Aug 8, 2003 Anonymous NYC

According to this salary, I am currently underpaid for doing Desktop Support. I have MCSE, MCSA, and CCNA. I've been in the field since 97. I should making 10K more. It's time to start looking for another job...

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

These reported salaries are probably what the people that are lucky enough to still have jobs wish they made. Even if they are true, enjoy it while you can though, because there are thousands of Indians and Chinese that are waiting to take your job at 10 cents on the dollar!

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Bel Boston

I think that the salaries reported are about right; at least where I kive and work. I do, however, want to point out that from my experience, some highly skilled employees are underpaid (or out of work) while some are extreemly overpaid for their level of expertise. As you all know, keeping your job and getting a high salary really depends mostly on how skillful you are at playing corporate POLITICS. Just look around your organization (if you are still employed) and see who is getting ahead..
My point is, do not give too much weight to certificates and technology. It is this soft skill (politics) that has the most impact on salaries!!! (Too bad it can't be mesured like other factors!)

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 HappyInDC DC

I understand many of the comments leaning toward the negative side of the salary figures. I only want to add that because your area may be low paying, that does not mean other areas don't easily match or surpass the salary figures. Help desk support staff here in DC start at about 45k and easily make 55K for the best tech.

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Michael Minnesota

rick, the salaries in Canada have always been a lot lower than the United States. In the height of the tech boom (96) I was in Toronto and looked through the want ads...the salaries were about 50% less than what they were paying in Minneapolis.

I've met plenty of guys that aren't paid what their worth as well, but whose fault is that? Some people enjoy working for government, non-profits, or simply don't negotiate well. It's not an employer's responsibility to equalize pay...I sure don't want to join a union.



Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Anonymous Atlanta, GA

It would be helpful to put the salaries in perspective against the cost of living in the area. Some places may make 30K and others 60K. But, if the 30K is in an area where the cost of living is cheaper may make that 60k much like 30K in buying power.

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 rick edmonton

listen your salary survey is full of crap!!!!!!!! I have 6 years experience, MCSE in NT4.0 and 2000 Network design certificate and security training certification and I make 48,000. My wife works for EDS Canada and makes 45,000 with 7 years experience as deskside and server support. How about you contact the companys themseleves and ask what they are paying not ask someone without a face who e-mails a dream amount.

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Anonymous KC

There are so many things that aren't measured here that are critical factors in how much a person can and does earn. The bottom line is that, just like any other job, your income relative to your peers depends upon 1) competence 2) people skills 3) post-hire educational pursuits 4) willingness to adapt to different goals/needs within the company. It didn't used to be this way, but IT is just no different anymore. Personally, I have a job which I would not trade for anything, and certification had little to do with getting hired. It was strongly encouraged as a means of developing ongoing proficiency, so I got MCSD over a period of about 2 years. Although it did get rewarded financially, it had nominal effect on my pay compared to competency reviews in general and people skills in particular. In addition, I have taken on many tasks that would not traditionally be pure IT functions, and the company has rewarded this also, as it saves them to some degree from having to hire or assign others. For many IT people, the 'feast or famine' workstyle must be discarded and the famine times used to be productive in other ways, if pay/advances are desired. If the company makes more money, I make more money. If I only do the minimum, I get paid the minimum...It is amazing how many people never clue into this, not just in IT, but certainly so.
Demographics: 7 yrs programming, MCSD, above avg pay according to this year's survey.

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Maybe I'm lucky, but the only cert I have is an MCSE in NT 4.0. I'm a network guy for a subset of a large company, and I'm making $62,000 a year. It helped that I got in at the right time (1998), but it also helped that I was willing to move. I don't buy the "I can't move" argument. If you really want to get ahead, a move might be necessary. So don't just sit around your hometown and wait, like a previous post said. Get out there and really look.

Thu, Aug 7, 2003 AnonymousMI Michigan

I'm a Netowork Admin working in Government. I get paid $70,000 a year and I was getting an average of 8%(Cost of living and yearly) a year in raises, although this has been cut down due to the economy. Although, I have a Masters in IT, I still feel blessed that I have a fairly stable position. The money is not bad and neither are the benifits. I've been in IT for 16 years and I remember I use to change jobs at the drop of a hat. I've talked to so many people in the IT field that are not working now. I'm just happy for right now and kind of leary of switching to a new job right now. Just my input.

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 Rob Fremont

Yeah well I have 3.5 years of experience and have MCP (NT and XP), CCNP 2.0 and CCDP 2.0 and make about $50,000 between 3 employers, but I am in silicon valley so I am a little below average if you consider the cost of living.

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 Anonymous USA

I've only been in the IT business for about 6 years. My first year I gradually got about 60k. I was all the way up to 90k, then got hit with a few layoffs. I got a new job for 70k, then got laid off again. Now I have a great job with the Feds in the IT dept. I'm at 80k a year plus boatloads of bennies. And the best thing is. Layoffs are basically non-existent. I am extremely grateful to have the job, and I was very surprised at the salary when the offer was made. From a dollar perspective, I have always made good money. I've got an NT MCSE, CCNA, CCSA (Checkpoint) and a MS Degree. IMO, the certs helped in the beginning, but for the job I have now they were of little importance. Regarding the survey, at least in my working world, A+ is considered the GED of the computer world. In other words, it's a joke. It's funny how much emphasis the mag puts in it. And the MCP and all of the other entry level certs in this economy don't hold a lot of water either.

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 quietly looking California

It's not all luck. It's a buyers market and the buyers (employers) are low balling everybody. They figure that if they can't afford experience, they'll hire the kid out of the six month tech school low ball the hell out of him, and take their chances. I took a position that was seriously low balled and I was saying "Hey, at least I got a job". Now, I'm entertaining other offers, I have two now that will pay me more in line with what I can make. If you're still looking, I know what you're going through. The market sucks, but it's not impossible.

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 Jim SW Ohio

This surveys is biased in the sense that they don't seem to look at other factors (college, age) and other certs. I know many companies consider a Microsoft cert as just gravy on top of Cisco, Novell, and Oracle certs they are really hiring for.

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 IT Manager New England

From the other side of the fence having previously been a certified network professional and now on the management end - I have personally hired several certified network professional and found that some of these people are taking the cert route to make as much salary as quickly as possible without wanting to put in the time and effort to develop a career. I have also worked with some very capable and highly motivated network professionals that also had certifications. A few words of advice to those certified pros out there looking for jobs or those with jobs looking for their companies to foot the bill for their certification - If an IT manager suspects that your looking for the fast buck via the look at my certs route then you probably going to find yourself receiving lowball salary offers...secondly if you expect your employer to pay for your certifications you have to earn your keep and in todays environment that means you have to have people skills in addition to technical skills, the days of the geek locked in the NOC are long gone, everyone in the organization today is relied on to contribute to development efforts and that means meetings and communicating with others especially those not as techno savvy as themselves. And lastly if you want the big bucks head for the major metro areas the downside is the cost to live in those areas there is always offshore opportunities if your up to the culture differences saveral of my firends have had great experiences via that route. Good Luck all!

Wed, Aug 6, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

you know the survey is bogus when it shows "Any MCP" making more then an "MCSA" considering that to become MCSA, you have to be an MCP first. Also, the salaries you show as average are quite low, maybe its demographics

Tue, Aug 5, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Have any of you that are looking for employment thought about going to a government agency job seminar. I work in the IT field for the U.S. Department of State and get a salary of $70,000 plus whether I work in D.C. or overseas. If I work in D.C. I get the 13% locality pay or if I am overseas I get the post allowance and/or cola if there is one. Get up and think about doing something different than just waiting for a job around your hometown.

Tue, Aug 5, 2003 Jay Florida

After reading all this i am beginning to believe that those numbers for salaries were fudged. I have my MCSE for NT and 2000 and currently going to school for my degree for Information tech. I am currently working in a stable company but i am only making about 33K a year. Sad i know... all the dreams of making 74000 a year seem to far to reach.

Tue, Aug 5, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I find it hard to believe that most computer techs are making what they claim to be. The job opportunities have dried up and there are no jobs. It is disturbing to see that some people who are a MCSE or CCNA are unemployed and cannot find work.

If I was to be let go by my company I would go back to school and get another career. This just is not worth getting stressed out by getting certified and then not able to secure a job!

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I am curious to see the information that was received, of those how many have a degree. There are some that don't have a degree. What are the pecentages and salaries for those people. I think that they are taking the best numbers only and posting them so they can look good. I agree with one of the other postings in that some of the information is misleading. It would be nice to get a straight forward answer.

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 Anonymous Boston

If you have a job right now, consider THAT the big benefit of you IT expertise. I am VERY lucky to be consulting now after my lay off. I know a lot of highly qualified hard working people that can not even get an interview, never mind a raise or good benefits. IF you have a job right now, keep your head down and your mouth shut...this market is brutal.

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 Ray Minneapolis

The IT industry is maturing, and as all previous industries, it becomes a commodity. The challenge for those that it affects are to either adapt, move beyond the mainstream, or to jump ship. There are still many IT professionals that are gainfully & optimistically employed.

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

ok... guess I will state it - I find this survey alittle off on the amounts, but for a different reason. I think they are too low. (I realize I may get "flames" for this) I am a MCDBA and have been working in IT for about 6yrs. I have worked at full time and consulting positions and currently I have been employed for almost 4yrs. I make 76,000 a year. I get 4 quarterly bonuses that are not guaranteed but based on performance of the company and myself. On average these add up to about $4500 (before taxes). I have had job offers recently for more at other businesses. And, I have had them for the same or alittle less. So, for those that read this - there is alittle hope.

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 ShawninMN MN

Experience....certifications...these are nice. The field is so saturated that you need soft skills to have a chance. The day of the pissy urban college dropout running networks is just about gone. If you don't start thinking in the "Team" format and being a positive addition, you're history. I am in a support role and I would say 30% of my job is purely tech. The rest is meetings, team building, customer satisfaction and industry research.

Mon, Aug 4, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

I can concure about these salary surveys. If been in this industry for several years with both MCSE 2000 and NT along with Novel certifications. I don't find my salary anywhere near what these stats say. I am making in the hi 30's, with no reimbursment for overtime payment...so I am confused. WNY certainly isn't the place for a good paying IT job. How many people did they poll, ten that work at Microsoft?

Sun, Aug 3, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Some people that don't earn the type of money that is in this and many other IT surveys out there must just live in areas where pay is low in general. I live in Washington DC, and the salary is right on with what me and other people I know in the industry are making. All of the survey's out there can't be flat wrong, but some are misleading when you realize that when you are looking at a single average salary, people in large metro areas drive the average up. If you want to make the big bucks, you have to go where the jobs and money are... unfortunatley the cost of living in places like DC, NY, San Fran and San Jose are much higher too. There are tradeoffs to making the highest salaries. I think MCP Mag does a good job breaking salary down by region, city, and whether the area is urban, suburban or rural. The also do a good job of looking at people in government, non-profit, and the private sector. Of course government and non-profits get paid less, and if you work in these areas, you should compare yourself to others in the same sector. One other observasion.... perhaps some of the people are complaining that the numbers are way off because they aren't even making what others in their area are making. In this case you should gather a few survey's together and show your bosses how you are underpaid. However, when you do this, you must be prepared to walk if the employer does not step up to the plate. Most people are afraid to do it in this economy, but you have to take some risk to get the rewards. If all you do is complain that the surveys MUST be wrong, you will never get paid what you deserve!

Sun, Aug 3, 2003 Anonymous Hartford

The numbers look about right to me. I am A+. Net+, MCP and have been working IT for about three years. I work as a contractor on OS Migration gigs in the area and average about $35K a year with about 3 months per year being unemployed. Full time pay for part time work. I love it. Sure beats selling insurance.

Sun, Aug 3, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

If you cap the low end the MCSE from Halifax is not on the scale. Where a CIO making a ton of money throws off the real value. The bottom should not be capped so that it includes the unemployed in our striving economy but to top must be capped to put the numbers in perspective. For example what is the average at Microsoft when you consider the big 3 which are 3 of the 5 richest in the world according to Forbes.

Sun, Aug 3, 2003 Anonymous Halifax, Nova Scotia

I have an MCSE (NT 4.0) and work with a software company as software/hardware/networking support technician. I make $28,000 Canadian (that's $19,000 U.S.) and I consider myself lucky. Who are these people making these huge salaries? I'd bet you could count them on two hands......at least in my city.

Sat, Aug 2, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

For a true salary survery you cannot cap the low or high end...

Sat, Aug 2, 2003 Anonymous Knoxville, TN

I have 7 years expirience MCSE NT 4 and 2k, A+ and Net+ and working as a network admin. I am way below the 47,100 for a helpdesk. The salary suveys would get laughed at instead of a job. There is no truth to them at all. I wished I could even come close to the bonuses stated it is a pure joke. It might help if they take into account the low end below $27,000 and cap it all at $80,000. CIO's and the such should not be included in the salaries estimates for a working person.

Sat, Aug 2, 2003 Anonymous Rochester, NY

I am highly skeptical about where these salary numbers came from. I have 5 years experiance and have held the Comp/TIA A+ and a Microsoft MCP certification all of that time. Plus a few others I have picked up as required. I have been laid off twice in the last 3 years from 2 different companies. The first company I worked for paid me $42,000 a year. Which according to the salary survey for that year was the avarage for an MCP. The last one being the 8th largest financial instiution in the US. Where my compensation started at $35,000 a year and topped out at $42,500 for my pay grade. I lost both jobs for the same reason. The local hardware support was contracted out to a vendor and the rest of my job was taken over by remote applications from the Network Operations Center. Now I don't doubt that some people are making the "average" salaries claimed in the survey. But I don't think you can equate someone who works in a IT sales type job or a company Chief Information Officer making $100,000+ a year with a Desktop Support person making $25,000 - 35,000 a year. And I have never come across a Helpdesk position paying $47,100 a year unless they were managing the company helpdesk operation.

Sat, Aug 2, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Anonymous 8/2/03 - great post! I fully support your stance and I too believe that both the survey and the staff at mcpmag.com are disreputable at best and delusional at worst. This issue of the magazine is the last that I will be receiving and I do not intend to revisit the website.

Sat, Aug 2, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

What's wrong with you people at MCP mag? Why do you consistently find it impossible to produce a survey that accurately reflects what's going on in the real world? This report is ludicrous! Have you NO conception whatsoever of the extent of the un- and under-employment going on out here?
If you are incapable of taking the effort to mass the resources needed to do a credible job, then you should quit this nonsense. Stop wasting our time with useless drivel. It does no one any good--except, possibly, help MCP mag's editorial staff justify their own existence and (I'm sure) overpaid positions.

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

take these salary surveys with a grain of salt. I worked with two "network" guys at a major storage company whose name is an Einstein equation who ran around with a fluke for 10 minutes and hid in there offices the rest of the day. They collectively worked for the company 30+ years and had 1 mcp and the ccna which they had only recently attained. My point being it is not the cert it's your tenure at the company that drives the salary my friends.

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 mcpcheesed Anonymous

Meaningless as long as they cut off salaries under 27,000 a year. I am MCSE CCNA A+ and experienced making less than that. I'm pretty damn cheesed about it too.

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Any salary survey like this is extremely slanted and designed, in this case, to market MS certs and how only people with certs are making big money. Not the case - not even believable.

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 MCPeeved Alabama

It doesn't matter which version I talk about. I have 20 yrs exp, mulitple premier certs and a degree yet I'm paid at least $10K below the averages. BUT, I have a job after being laid off almost a year ago. I'm quite happy and thankful for my job!

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

That's all good and everything, but that doesn't take into account the 10% of respondents who were layed off...

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 Anonymous Dallas

I agree with the comment made by Anonymous on 7/29/03. These figures are low (Although not twice as low) and I hope employers don't look at this and attempt to lower the bar.

Fri, Aug 1, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Me? I think most of the people who responded to the survey were lying through their teeth. These figures are completely ludicrous. MCSE's are a dime a dozen...

Tue, Jul 29, 2003 MCAD Richmond

They can find well qualified people for very little now because of the economy. The salary survey data I think is misleading. People cannot be making that type of money on the average in today's economy. I was most interested in the data on the important of certifications. That was the best piece of imformation in the survey. Personally I think the developer certs do make a different. I can't speak about the system admin certs. But it's good to see that they still means something.

Tue, Jul 29, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

The pdf download is very useful and convenient. Thanks.

Tue, Jul 29, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Why do the sample profiles reflect such low salaries when the average salaries by metroplitan region are often twice as much. This gives employers the notion that they can find well-qualified people for very little.

Sun, Jul 27, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

Yeah right. I made my company over 40 million dollars last year in a big sale that was attributed to only me. I am an engineer, not a sales rep. After 2 years of no raise I got 4% raise that does not equal a col raise...Companies do not care about their employees. We are replaceable.

Thu, Jul 24, 2003 chris S.A., TX

Visiting your site for the first time, but like ITnrg, I was surprised that allow the profantiy. Especialliy let it sit there for almost a year. Maybe it is a product of the environment.

Mon, Jul 14, 2003 Jack Anonymous

IT field sucks. Many people in IT DO NOT have atleast a BS Degree from college. Carpenters, Plumbers, Auto Mechanics and the likes are in the IT field.

Wed, Jul 9, 2003 Anon Ohio

Yes, true a sixteen year old can get an MSCE, but very few, not all, can communicate with their boss and/or co-workers. I am sixteen years old, MSCE+1 certified and part-time employed making $52.47 an hour; is that because I can't communicate with my boss and/or co-workers? Speak in general terms Einstein, and keep me out of your stubborn, media endorsed, stereotypical, and irrational attempt to conceive all teenagers as one entity.

Thu, Jul 3, 2003 Dave Midwest

Can't any of you certified dudes write an email filter to get rid of the filth on your site? Not very good PR.

Thu, Jul 3, 2003 Dave Midwest

Can't any of you certified dudes write an email filter to get rid of the filth on your site? Not very good PR.

Sat, Jun 28, 2003 Sohail Riyadh

Hi, I am a Sybase Certified PowerBuilder developer. I have 6 years experience in PB. Without having any experience in Visual Basic 6 I could able to pass MCP exam. Now in which area should I try for a job in US - PB or VB?

Mon, Jun 23, 2003 Anonymous Washington

Most IT guys here fail to understand that once you are out of the job, it's another playing field. Yeah, so long as you have a job, it's easy to make silly comments like most are.

Sun, Jun 22, 2003 Wole Dallas

To me, certification is continuing Education. Microsoft created all this certifications for a reason. You have to be able to separate yourself from the crowd. The experience will come over time but as you continue to age in the industry, you'll find out you need to achieve something unique to distinguish yourself, regardless of how other people might view it. All is takes to succeed is passion!. I wish you all the best.

Wole
MCSD.

Fri, Jun 20, 2003 techie Mid west

I have an A+, Net+, & MCP and about 6 years experience... I have NO idea where these folks get there numbers? THose that take the surveys must be lying??? I make $33k/yr... no where near the $60k/yr listed! So am I being messed over in this company that I work for? Or are the stats wrong???

Tue, Jun 17, 2003 Anonymous S.Africa

One Question back : Can anyone be that stupid???

Sat, Jun 14, 2003 Nimish Shah Williamsburg, Virginia

Sir, I am looking for a entry level Job in the Computer field, I know Weg Page designing- FrontPage, Html, Office Suites,
C & C+, FoxPro-Database. Please inform me, so I can send you my Resume
Awaiting for your reply Thank you Nimish

Thu, Jun 12, 2003 kudos somewhere

I am a 16 year old MCP. I WORKED incredibly hard to gain my certification. Wanna know what I'm doing now? Working in an office implementing Windows.

Wed, Jun 4, 2003 ref malaysia

got my degree, tried to find a job,terrible job market, decided to study some more, doin the mcse,mcsa,mcdba,mcsd,ccna and ccnp now, lol

hell, hope it's worth it.

Wed, Jun 4, 2003 Jesper Denmark

Surferdude... Not quite right. I'm a CCIE and I make more than the 91,900$ that is listed in the 2001 table. So do most other CCIE's in Denmark.

Fri, May 30, 2003 zaka India

Its a good analysis of what goes on in getting the first job. I searched jobs for nearly 6 months and finally decided to work voluntarily for a firm...if it works i will get a job soon

Mon, May 26, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

One Question: Is the comment by Bill Gates from the Microsoft Bill Gates?

Tue, May 13, 2003 dennis south florida

The more you learn, the more you earn, but in this case microsoft earns through tests. mcse, college degree, making 11 an hour, what a joke. Applied for job that was posted yesterday and 650 people responded in 1 day the recruiter tells me.

Thu, May 8, 2003 zeead mauritius

hi, am a new mcp in mauritius. normally i'd like to know about a mcp's salary. 1. without experience. 2. with experience.??

thank you in advance.
zeead

Thu, Apr 24, 2003 olambra south africa

I wish I knew how to get hired, I am holding at present a MCP MCSD qualification, but with no avail, still independently developing software for companies in my area. So sorry to say, don't have much faith in ever getting appointed. ps I am registered all over the world at job search sites and have applied for almost 300 positions, anything from student level to entry level.

Mon, Apr 21, 2003 jayant india

sir,
hope to get hired .so i would like to know the ways of it .

Fri, Apr 18, 2003 startingout malaysia

Well, I have a degree in Computing, majoring in Internet Technology and I can't find a job, so it was either go for the masters or start up on MCSE/MCSD/CCNA/CCNP, which i am doing now. The thing is, what kind of salary should I be expecting when I finish, the certs are pretty tough.I know I lack serious experience and although I know my stuff, it's going to be tough going up against other people with working experience of up to say 3-10 years.

Sun, Feb 23, 2003 califtech California

I am in and around many in the IT field and even those with many years and less certs vs those with many certs and few years are not making that money! Re-check your figures.

Wed, Feb 12, 2003 dreamer philippines

I agreed to all posters here. In addition to get hired, a person must know him/her self, his/her capability and the job he/she applying for. Communication is the best tool and ladder to success. Must know efficiently how to sell him/her self. The big factor is, he/she must have experience with certifications. Thus company entertain only applicants with qualification.

Tue, Feb 11, 2003 Bill Gates Anonymous

Sorry SUCKAS!!!!
It careers are very LOW paying!
I'm the one who's making the big bucks, thanks to you losers spending a fortune on useless certification exams.

Fri, Feb 7, 2003 GreenBacks ireland

there can be a whole catalogue of things to improve your position my strategy is to introduce "Cost saving measures" that rely on specialist knowledge so that basically they are stuck with me and cant get anyone to understand the processes involved so try to get THEM over a barrell ! hopefully they wont run the risk of losing U :-)

Thu, Feb 6, 2003 Tracy-Ann Jamaica

I hold persons with their qualifications in high esteem, it says that they know the worth of a good educational back ground. I assist the IT specialist in my office and think he is excellent at what he does (go Vince). We put a lot of work in acquiring these Certs. All the best to the other IT persons. It is worth your time.

Thu, Feb 6, 2003 dave london uk

im 18yr old from london going to uni in september 2003, applying for a computing and management degree. does IT consultancy have good international salary and job prospects, as im thinking of going to the US to settle down

Mon, Feb 3, 2003 Anonymous India

Have MCSE and looking for job.(certified in JAVA,VB AND SQL).Any leads let me know

Mon, Jan 20, 2003 Anonymous Anonymous

If you do more and cut costs for your company, they don't say 'yes, you deserve a raise'. Instead they say, 'thanks for doing your job and making the company more stable and productive. Now you can keep you job and have some stability.' Tasem is smoking something...

Wed, Jan 15, 2003 olumide Nigeria

I dont know about u folks but here in Nigeria the hiring market 4 an mcse is quite low and most of the so called mcses do not have the experience 4 the job.The cert has to be given more value the lesser pepole with the cert the better the job market 4 every one.T o many pepole have the ceert and cant do the job giving the cert and micro soft a bad name.We need something most people dont have.work on it!

Wed, Jan 15, 2003 olumide Arogbonlo Nigeria Kaduna

I dont know about u folks but here in Nigeria the hiring market 4 an mcse is quite low and most of the so called mcses do not have the experience 4 the job.The cert has to be given more value the lesser pepole with the cert the better the job market 4 every one.T o many pepole have the ceert and cant do the job giving the cert and micro soft a bad name.We need something most people dont have.work on it!

Sun, Dec 29, 2002 Doug Rochester, NY

I have my MCP, MCP+I, MCSE and A+... I work as an electrical designer and IT at the same company.. 75%-25% ratio.. What would you think is a good salary for a hard worker doing both jobs?
Electrical Designer/IT(help support)
Thanks!

Sun, Dec 29, 2002 gabriel nottingham, england

i got my MCSE when i was only 17, read all the book and braindumps. i havent got any experience at all becos i am in school. I definitely think having hands on experience is the best way about it.

Wed, Dec 25, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

the name of iranian have certified of mcse

Tue, Dec 24, 2002 Anand FL

I think one should look at the certification to add a value to your knowledge. Although experience is unbeatable.

Cert. + Experience = Chance for Interview. Then knowledge and your expertise to win the job.

But it is your knowledge at the end which will survive you in difficult time.

Tue, Dec 17, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

Event if a company is doing well these days they'll take advantage of the general economic environment and make excuses for not giving their employees salary raises. I’m so sick of the attitude…

Fri, Dec 6, 2002 Tushar Makwana Baroda-Gujarat, INDIA

Sir,

I am MCP with sql, and VB.
Just am giving you general information and I want a Job anywhere in USA.
So if possible just inform me through mail so that am sending you my CV.
Hoping for reply soon.
Thanks

Tushar

Wed, Dec 4, 2002 Mike redmond

if these are "averages" maybe i should quit working so hard and just be an average worker, maybe ill get a pay raise!

Wed, Dec 4, 2002 PA NY

In these tough economic times and high rate of unemployment each person should examine their situation individually and honestly determine a few points. Are you a value to the company and have tangible proof to this? In your market, how quickly can your position be replaced due to a highly competitive job marketplace? These a some of the basic factors should assist your decision on if a raise is desired or required.

Mon, Dec 2, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

chinguen todos a su reputisima madre, fuck everywant else

Tue, Nov 26, 2002 jjpedro Seattle

Too bad this posting system does not have a spell check routine. Anywayz, keep the faith to all that pursue certifications. This is the only way we can continue to keep in workforce an make a decent living. Keep the faith!

Tue, Nov 26, 2002 jjpedro Seattle

Whether or not a person decides to cap the information we all need to get some kind of certification to ensure the company we want to work with that we know what our jobs are. We cap our information when we want others to know that we are making a statement and when we are proud of our accomplishments. I am merely reflecting to what anon said is the post. We all know we use caps when we are yelling when we use email. We use caps in our posts when we want to state something that is important. Read again what the first post says and you will understnad that it means that we all must know what we are after and what we have to do to get there. Amen.

Fri, Nov 22, 2002 surferdude california

I enjoy looking at entertainment that makes me chuckle... such as these overzealous figures.. I guess they pick one person who makes the most money and holds that cert. Most of us makes far less money...

Fri, Nov 22, 2002 ITnrg Northeast

Surprised that you allow profanity on your site. Are you guys frustrated or just a product of your environment?

Wed, Nov 13, 2002 Andrey Russia

You're lucky you don't live in Russia! Just imagine salary - 300$ peer month!!!!!

Fri, Nov 1, 2002 some guy in the middle of the Pacific Ocean

You're lucky you don't live in Hawaii! Just imagine every salary half of what they are showing here. Time to move I guess...

Thu, Oct 31, 2002 Santa Claus North Pole

HO-HO-HO. That is all.

Thu, Oct 31, 2002 Me someplace special

I just want to make a lot of money and move out of mommy's house!!!

Thu, Oct 31, 2002 someone d.c.

grow up little children and wash your mouth out.

Thu, Oct 17, 2002 dont ive a fuck skrew you

your a stupid mother fucking piece of shit

Thu, Oct 17, 2002 fuck you shit

go fuck your self i dont core you ugly piece of shit

Fri, Sep 27, 2002 ERA Pittsburgh

I believe both sides are right. Certs. with experience is the way to go. A person with the experience can only enhance his/her knowledge by getting certified. This would give an IT job candidate overwhelming edge in selling him or herself. Get the experience and the Certs.

Tue, Sep 17, 2002 fares syria

dear consultant :
i'm working on taking the MCSE certification for the next year , there is no sifn that jobs will be3 availablle in my country , my qustion is who much personal nationality effects on the salary
avrage
with graet thanks

Mon, Sep 16, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

What is the most common salery for a pediatrician

Mon, Sep 9, 2002 Anonymous London UK

I have been in the IT reseller industry for 5 years and in IT for longer than that. I think the MCSE certification is often regarded as the starting point of any offer.

In a world that uses employment agencies more and more it is often the case you are dealing with what it is effectively a person who has very little understanding of the positons detailed requirements and is working from a script.

If you turn up with the correct certifications and personality you will then move to interview. Whilst if you turn up without the prerequisit paperwork you can find it harder to get in the door. The reality of course is that you often find that both candidates would be perfectly capable of filling the position.

I have seen friends in the industry apply for a position only to be brushed off because they do not have the qualifications, and through shear persistance and bloody mindedness manage to persuade the agency to send them for interview. Where they got the job.
Working for a reseller it is part of my job requirement to stay qualified in the latest technology available.

Mon, Aug 26, 2002 degsco Northeast USA

MCSE is just another piece of paper. I have been in the IT business for 12 years and have met some of the worst IT people that are MCSE's. Mostly working FOR me and they weren't worth the paper their certs were printed on. Don't get me wrong... I'm not saying all MCSE's are worthless, there are some really sharp people out there that have these certs. But I have also met a lot more that don't have these certs that are just as sharp.

Sat, Aug 24, 2002 Vijay Chicago

Given that many people have certifications (MCSE, A+, etc), the obvious variable is communication and soft skills - the lack of which can easily thwart one's chance at landing a job. It's not an interview, it's a sales pitch! Learn to communicate and speak effectively and it will come in handy well past your hire date!

Sun, Aug 18, 2002 A.R. Pacific Northwest

It's true. You NEED a good personality and communcation skills to get a job over other professionals. A 16 year old kid can get an MCSE. But, can a 16 communicate effectively with he/her co-workers and bosses? Nope. I DO NOT have ANY certifications. I was hired over 285 other professionals for my position (IT Manager/2000 server speciality), which included 167(!) MCSE's!! The REASON they hired me was because I was able to TALK with them effectively, be nice, communicate, and hey, sparkle. THAT IS WHAT IT TAKES. PERIOD. I'm living proof.

Sat, Aug 17, 2002 anon anon

I find it ironic that an "MCSE" doesn't even realize that typing in upper case is yelling. It doesn't matter what certs you have, if you are lacking in fundamental skills, then you will fail any interview that has a hands-on portion.

Fri, Aug 9, 2002 Carlos Valdez Miami

I don't think it is as difficult to get a job as the article states. There is still a lot good opportunities outthere and as long as you dedicate the time and get your certs, you should make it.
Certiofications are very important.
I agree that you should never stop learnng. Good luck and happy hunting.

Fri, Aug 9, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

It depends on where you work and what your doing for your company. Personally I dont trust any company...all they care about is their golden parachutes...not the employees

Sat, Aug 3, 2002 Anonymous Anonymous

AS I HAVE JUST COMPLETED MY MCSE & MCSA ,WHAT I THINK IF YOU KNOW ABOUT YOUR PROFESSION YOU NEVER GET DISAPPIONTED .

Mon, Jul 29, 2002 Mark H. Anonymous

I"d like to know what the salerys are of others who hold multiple certs like mcse + mcsd + mcdba

Mark

Add Your Comment Now:

Your Name:(optional)
Your Email:(optional)
Your Location:(optional)
Comment:
Please type the letters/numbers you see above

Redmond Tech Watch

Sign up for our newsletter.

I agree to this site's Privacy Policy.